I'd like to see an unpacking of what meaning is . I understood your reframe by observing my father who has retired and struggles to figure out how to use his time.
Yet, I wonder if words like meaning and purpose are too loaded with alternate meanings/baggage to get the point across. Another framing I've been thinking about is challenge and finding your own tension.
Every story needs intention and obstacles, that create tension. If there are obstacles that feel impossible, the difference between a tragedy and adventure is if they are overcome or not.
But if there are no obstacles, the story is flat and boring.
What's difficult about defining meaning is it's one of those "you know it when you have it" feelings.
Kinda like love... e.g. can you define "love"? If you fall in love or if you feel love from a parent/family member, you know exactly what I'm talking about. But how would you explain it? Deconstruct it? That's a problem poets have been working on for centuries 😅
You're tension point is interesting, and I'd be curious to hear more about what you think. Every story does need obstacles, but that is a GOOD STORY. Is that the same as a GOOD LIFE? E.g. if you ever fall in love w/ someone, do you need massive obstacles to overcome in order to experience that love? I'm not so sure... But I'd be curious to hear more.
Hey Rick, we discussed this topic a while back on one of my posts, at the time I suggested Freedom was the highest aim, you suggested Meaning was. Well like you, after nearly 2 years of "freedom" I have come around to your way of thinking. At the time I was trying to define freedom not as time/money freedom, which is what most people think of, but I was trying to frame it as existential freedom. But after thinking (and living) it out, I think what I was really trying to define was in fact Meaning. I do still differentiate time/money freedom vs existential freedom as a material vs spiritual contrast, but at the end of the day, there can be no existential freedom without some kind of undergirding meaning.
Put more simply: a person without freedom but who has meaning can live a rich and rewarding life, even if it's a struggle at times. But a person with freedom and no meaning is destined for ennui, listlessness, purposelessness, etc which are all a form of privileged existential suffering.
In practice I'm still working out what all of the above mean for me, I find myself oscillating between enjoying my freedom but wrestling frequently with what to do with said freedom. At many points over the past couple years I've found myself asking, "What am I doing here?", (not geographically but existentially) which is a meaning question, not a freedom question.
Really appreciated this read. It’s a good reminder that aimless wandering won’t bring more fulfillment than grinding 90-hour weeks, but having the freedom to pursue meaning on your own terms is what makes all the struggle worthwhile. Excited to see where your book project goes!
I suspect the intermediate milestone absolutely involves no longer feeling a precise obligation to 'do something' with that freedom, rather finding one's sense of self and purpose casually filling in that void with something implausibly fulfilling and loaded with purpose... which sounds absolutely like the kind of nonsense somebody would write in a book to sell lots of copies, and is in no way helpful for anybody staring down any of these possibilities.
2. Then I got time freedom and this is better!! (usually true)
Almost everyone promoting this talking point pursued financial wealth like an animal.
I probably wouldnt use the word meaning, though. I'd go even simpler. The only real wealth is having things you really care about.
I think a lot of people obtain wealth by selling out their caring and that leads to disaster. That's why they wish they were back in the previous life path.
My journey has been from cynically not caring (and pursuing wealth) to caring about stuff and now not caring as much about wealth at all
I agree with your first part. Freedom > money, but when you pursue it as your only source of meaning, you'll eventually get what you want and realize you have nothing else.
On caring... I think you're 100% onto what I'm talking about. Rather than wait for perfect freedom, you're focused on what you care about, which is the endgame that actually matters. Inserting a reach-freedom objective in between would lead you totally off track, maybe permanently.
On caring vs. meaning... I think we generally agree and probably splitting hairs on our own preferred use of language. For me, meaning = umbrella term that includes caring/loving for people/activities. But also also encompasses additional components:
- sense of belonging (e.g. community)
- moral guidance (e.g. sense of right/wrong >> I mean this very abstractly, not like accepting external guidelines)
- coherent narrative (e.g. the world and your place in it)
I could be wrong... but it sounds like you DO have belonging, you just may not call it that or take for granted what you have.
E.g. your last post: "Living in so many different places doesn’t make me feel unsettled; I feel grounded in a deep sense of possibility and wonder for the world."
I mean, right there you're saying you find your belonging in more of the diversity/collection/ecology of places than one place vs. another. Am I interpreting you wrong?
At least for myself (but bet others feel this too), I find belonging in being tribe-diverse vs. tribe-specific. Specific tribes make me feel claustrophobic, and I don't need a local, in-person cult-community breathing down my neck to feel part of something. Instead, I find belonging in occasionally (but not too frequently or else it'd defeat the purpose) finding other people who think like that or at least knowing they exist are out there. Pair that with my immediate family + close friends = I'm good.
For sure, I think I just naturally avoid words like meaning because they mean too much now. And belonging as well.
For me, I just prefer the word connection. Connection to self, other, work and place. Writer preferences 😂
Regardless, I think I strongly agree with your point. “Wealth” it’s not a useful aim because it implies accumulation of some resource. Better aims can’t be accumulated. Love, meaning, connection.
I'd like to see an unpacking of what meaning is . I understood your reframe by observing my father who has retired and struggles to figure out how to use his time.
Yet, I wonder if words like meaning and purpose are too loaded with alternate meanings/baggage to get the point across. Another framing I've been thinking about is challenge and finding your own tension.
Every story needs intention and obstacles, that create tension. If there are obstacles that feel impossible, the difference between a tragedy and adventure is if they are overcome or not.
But if there are no obstacles, the story is flat and boring.
Thanks Ved. Maybe not perfect answer to your question, but I do expand on the meaning of meaning here (plus old vs. new versions):
https://newsletter.thewayofwork.com/p/frontier
What's difficult about defining meaning is it's one of those "you know it when you have it" feelings.
Kinda like love... e.g. can you define "love"? If you fall in love or if you feel love from a parent/family member, you know exactly what I'm talking about. But how would you explain it? Deconstruct it? That's a problem poets have been working on for centuries 😅
You're tension point is interesting, and I'd be curious to hear more about what you think. Every story does need obstacles, but that is a GOOD STORY. Is that the same as a GOOD LIFE? E.g. if you ever fall in love w/ someone, do you need massive obstacles to overcome in order to experience that love? I'm not so sure... But I'd be curious to hear more.
Hey Rick, we discussed this topic a while back on one of my posts, at the time I suggested Freedom was the highest aim, you suggested Meaning was. Well like you, after nearly 2 years of "freedom" I have come around to your way of thinking. At the time I was trying to define freedom not as time/money freedom, which is what most people think of, but I was trying to frame it as existential freedom. But after thinking (and living) it out, I think what I was really trying to define was in fact Meaning. I do still differentiate time/money freedom vs existential freedom as a material vs spiritual contrast, but at the end of the day, there can be no existential freedom without some kind of undergirding meaning.
Put more simply: a person without freedom but who has meaning can live a rich and rewarding life, even if it's a struggle at times. But a person with freedom and no meaning is destined for ennui, listlessness, purposelessness, etc which are all a form of privileged existential suffering.
In practice I'm still working out what all of the above mean for me, I find myself oscillating between enjoying my freedom but wrestling frequently with what to do with said freedom. At many points over the past couple years I've found myself asking, "What am I doing here?", (not geographically but existentially) which is a meaning question, not a freedom question.
Damn... you nailed it Dave.
Your middle paragraph really nails what I see as a fundamental error in American (at least) thinking: that freedom alone is the answer.
(just like money-alone is the answer, or health-alone, etc.)
Many would be much better off, yes pursuing freedom, but simultaneously pursuing meaning because the former may not come until too late / not at all.
Really appreciated this read. It’s a good reminder that aimless wandering won’t bring more fulfillment than grinding 90-hour weeks, but having the freedom to pursue meaning on your own terms is what makes all the struggle worthwhile. Excited to see where your book project goes!
You nailed it right there.
Outstanding!!!!! So well written and on-point. Thank you!
Thanks Tom for the feedback!
I needed this in my inbox today. It hit home. Thank you.
Glad it resonated, Michael. Curious what made this hit and/or relate to your life?
Isn’t the only true freedom - freedom from the idea of freedom?
I suspect the intermediate milestone absolutely involves no longer feeling a precise obligation to 'do something' with that freedom, rather finding one's sense of self and purpose casually filling in that void with something implausibly fulfilling and loaded with purpose... which sounds absolutely like the kind of nonsense somebody would write in a book to sell lots of copies, and is in no way helpful for anybody staring down any of these possibilities.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
I have zero clean answers for you. All I have is my experience, which I've tried to deconstruct and am selling for the discounted price of $0 (forever): https://newsletter.thewayofwork.com/i/149175100/series-dont-work
Buy now!
Woah, now that's heavy! 🤯
Now we're talking...
(definitely gonna think on that)
I suspect what people are really saying is:
1. I used to think money was wealth
2. Then I got time freedom and this is better!! (usually true)
Almost everyone promoting this talking point pursued financial wealth like an animal.
I probably wouldnt use the word meaning, though. I'd go even simpler. The only real wealth is having things you really care about.
I think a lot of people obtain wealth by selling out their caring and that leads to disaster. That's why they wish they were back in the previous life path.
My journey has been from cynically not caring (and pursuing wealth) to caring about stuff and now not caring as much about wealth at all
I agree with your first part. Freedom > money, but when you pursue it as your only source of meaning, you'll eventually get what you want and realize you have nothing else.
On caring... I think you're 100% onto what I'm talking about. Rather than wait for perfect freedom, you're focused on what you care about, which is the endgame that actually matters. Inserting a reach-freedom objective in between would lead you totally off track, maybe permanently.
On caring vs. meaning... I think we generally agree and probably splitting hairs on our own preferred use of language. For me, meaning = umbrella term that includes caring/loving for people/activities. But also also encompasses additional components:
- sense of belonging (e.g. community)
- moral guidance (e.g. sense of right/wrong >> I mean this very abstractly, not like accepting external guidelines)
- coherent narrative (e.g. the world and your place in it)
FYI I explore the concept of meaning more here and the "inherited maps of meaning" vs. the "open frontier of meaning": https://newsletter.thewayofwork.com/p/frontier
Yeah I think for me I have just found good enough setups without belonging (albeit have it at nuclear family level)
I could be wrong... but it sounds like you DO have belonging, you just may not call it that or take for granted what you have.
E.g. your last post: "Living in so many different places doesn’t make me feel unsettled; I feel grounded in a deep sense of possibility and wonder for the world."
I mean, right there you're saying you find your belonging in more of the diversity/collection/ecology of places than one place vs. another. Am I interpreting you wrong?
At least for myself (but bet others feel this too), I find belonging in being tribe-diverse vs. tribe-specific. Specific tribes make me feel claustrophobic, and I don't need a local, in-person cult-community breathing down my neck to feel part of something. Instead, I find belonging in occasionally (but not too frequently or else it'd defeat the purpose) finding other people who think like that or at least knowing they exist are out there. Pair that with my immediate family + close friends = I'm good.
For sure, I think I just naturally avoid words like meaning because they mean too much now. And belonging as well.
For me, I just prefer the word connection. Connection to self, other, work and place. Writer preferences 😂
Regardless, I think I strongly agree with your point. “Wealth” it’s not a useful aim because it implies accumulation of some resource. Better aims can’t be accumulated. Love, meaning, connection.
Interesting angle on wealth = accumulation of a resource.
Will definitely think on that one.
Something to ponder: it is not the pursuit of happiness but the happiness of the pursuit?